How to hook up battery to breaker Box - Good Old RVs2024-03-29T14:55:21Zhttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/forum/topics/how-to-hook-up-battery-to-breaker-box?feed=yes&xn_auth=noCarmella - What do you want t…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-09-28:2093474:Comment:3039432016-09-28T20:12:13.992Zzane lilehttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/profile/zanelile
<p>Carmella - What do you want to run from the battery ? I have a 12 ' I built myself - I run the water pump, light in bathroom, light in kitchen,from the battery. I also have a refrig, I can run off an inverter it is only about 100 watts, 12 v, 120v are LP gas, so I can get by with a 400 watt inverter. I normally run the refrig. off lp when boondocking, but I can switch to 12v if needed. The cook top, by all means go to LP gas. Do you have a water heater ? I run my W.H. off lp along with my…</p>
<p>Carmella - What do you want to run from the battery ? I have a 12 ' I built myself - I run the water pump, light in bathroom, light in kitchen,from the battery. I also have a refrig, I can run off an inverter it is only about 100 watts, 12 v, 120v are LP gas, so I can get by with a 400 watt inverter. I normally run the refrig. off lp when boondocking, but I can switch to 12v if needed. The cook top, by all means go to LP gas. Do you have a water heater ? I run my W.H. off lp along with my cook top, I do also carry a small generator when I leave the house. When you add, a cook top, refrigerator, AC, lights, and other, the use of electricity goes wany up. To recharge you need a battery charger a simple unit like for your car are a comb. unit. The breaker box you talk of, is for the 110 volt shore power, you will have to add fuses are another breaker box for your 12 volts.Write back and let us know what all you wish to run off battery and how long you wish to be with out shore power, we can then help you more.In fact whenyou tell us the rest of the story we can draw you a diagram of how to wire the trailer. Good luck.</p> This is why GORV's is such a…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-24:2093474:Comment:2902912016-04-24T15:48:31.871ZRich Thomashttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/profile/RichThomas
<p>This is why GORV's is such a great place. An exchange of Ideas on a common topic. My take from all this is a well balanced RV is going to have a good balance of LP, AC and DC. and can be tailored one way or the other to favor the source for the intended use. Then there's that whole Black water thing?</p>
<p>This is why GORV's is such a great place. An exchange of Ideas on a common topic. My take from all this is a well balanced RV is going to have a good balance of LP, AC and DC. and can be tailored one way or the other to favor the source for the intended use. Then there's that whole Black water thing?</p> Carmelita: Sorry that this di…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-24:2093474:Comment:2903632016-04-24T00:20:16.888ZMatthew Tritthttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/xn/detail/u_1xuchw22d2r3t
<p>Carmelita: Sorry that this discussion went off the rails, but there is one thing I need to say before I give it up. That is that your idea about using an electric cooker is pretty-much impossible - unless you always have access to shore power when you head out to the wilds. Propane is much faster, hotter and just plain better for cooking, so keep that gas cooktop and save yourself a lot of grief. You CANNOT use an inverter to power a cook stove. You would need a very large battery bank and a…</p>
<p>Carmelita: Sorry that this discussion went off the rails, but there is one thing I need to say before I give it up. That is that your idea about using an electric cooker is pretty-much impossible - unless you always have access to shore power when you head out to the wilds. Propane is much faster, hotter and just plain better for cooking, so keep that gas cooktop and save yourself a lot of grief. You CANNOT use an inverter to power a cook stove. You would need a very large battery bank and a very large, expensive inverter, as well as a good generator to accomplish the same thing you can with just a 5 gallon bottle of propane and a decent propane stove.</p> Exactamente! As I recall, whe…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-24:2093474:Comment:2904802016-04-24T00:12:20.454ZMatthew Tritthttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/xn/detail/u_1xuchw22d2r3t
<p>Exactamente! As I recall, when I camped in my 59 VW kinda-camper, I felt priveleged to have a place to sleep that wasn't on the hard, cold ground. Having the little icebox was much better than a bunch of soggy cardboard and plastic bags floating around in the bottom of a portable ice chest and 5 gallons of onboard water delivered with a hand pump was pretty neat too. I say just leave the little trailers be with the minimalistic systems they have and be happy that you don't have to fold up a…</p>
<p>Exactamente! As I recall, when I camped in my 59 VW kinda-camper, I felt priveleged to have a place to sleep that wasn't on the hard, cold ground. Having the little icebox was much better than a bunch of soggy cardboard and plastic bags floating around in the bottom of a portable ice chest and 5 gallons of onboard water delivered with a hand pump was pretty neat too. I say just leave the little trailers be with the minimalistic systems they have and be happy that you don't have to fold up a wet tent when it's time to head home. (Of course, I say this after sinking a deplorable amount of dough into upgrading my own RV!)</p> Yeppers Matthew, I'm scrollin…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-23:2093474:Comment:2901922016-04-23T19:15:58.935ZJohn "T" Nordhoffhttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/profile/JohnT
<p>Yeppers Matthew, I'm scrolling down through all this and Ima thinking this is a 12 ft Trailer NOT a 45 Ft Prevost 50 amp Humongous Motorhome lol. Hey two golf cart batteries,,,,,,,,,,,A 30 amp or so Progressive Dynamics Smart 3/4 Stage Charger with Charge Wizard,,,,,,,,,,,A 400 Watt stand alone PSW Inverter for small electronics and charging,,,,,,,,,,,,A 30 amp shore power cord and a small combination 12 VDC and 120 VAC panel IS PLENTY. You start talking Magnum Inverter/Chargers, they may…</p>
<p>Yeppers Matthew, I'm scrolling down through all this and Ima thinking this is a 12 ft Trailer NOT a 45 Ft Prevost 50 amp Humongous Motorhome lol. Hey two golf cart batteries,,,,,,,,,,,A 30 amp or so Progressive Dynamics Smart 3/4 Stage Charger with Charge Wizard,,,,,,,,,,,A 400 Watt stand alone PSW Inverter for small electronics and charging,,,,,,,,,,,,A 30 amp shore power cord and a small combination 12 VDC and 120 VAC panel IS PLENTY. You start talking Magnum Inverter/Chargers, they may cost more then the trailer lol </p>
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<p> Oh well were havin fun right</p>
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<p> John T</p> The flexible shore power cord…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-23:2093474:Comment:2902772016-04-23T16:48:47.728ZMatthew Tritthttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/xn/detail/u_1xuchw22d2r3t
<p>The flexible shore power cord required for boats and RV's alike is waterproof SO cord, not residential stranded conductors. 50 amps is a LOT of current, and equals 6,000 Watts @ 120 VAC. 30 amps is bad enough @ 3,600 Watts. In my occupation as a off-grid power systems designer/installer I have to (or had to) deal with large SO cord a lot and I can assure you that # 6 isn't something commonly available outside of wholesale electrical warehouses. # 8, not so scarce.</p>
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<p>By AC I mean…</p>
<p>The flexible shore power cord required for boats and RV's alike is waterproof SO cord, not residential stranded conductors. 50 amps is a LOT of current, and equals 6,000 Watts @ 120 VAC. 30 amps is bad enough @ 3,600 Watts. In my occupation as a off-grid power systems designer/installer I have to (or had to) deal with large SO cord a lot and I can assure you that # 6 isn't something commonly available outside of wholesale electrical warehouses. # 8, not so scarce.</p>
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<p>By AC I mean Alternating Current, not Air Conditioner. My ancient 10,000 BTU FrigiKing off-road air conditioner requires a 15 amp circuit, so I assume that it runs at around 12 amps on high - but I've never actuall clamped it to find out.</p> Right-on, John. I had a 12' t…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-23:2093474:Comment:2904762016-04-23T16:08:52.349ZMatthew Tritthttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/xn/detail/u_1xuchw22d2r3t
<p>Right-on, John. I had a 12' trailer 45 years ago that had 2 propane lamps and 3 12 volt lamps. No AC at all and the fridge was an icebox. Water was supplied by a marine hand pump and the head was a porta-potty. People these days are used to so many creature comforts! ;-) The emphasis in the 50's trailers was on lightness and simplicity, which is an excellent thing in very small camp trailers.</p>
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<p>I also have a Progressive Dynamics smart charger and monitor, which is a huge…</p>
<p>Right-on, John. I had a 12' trailer 45 years ago that had 2 propane lamps and 3 12 volt lamps. No AC at all and the fridge was an icebox. Water was supplied by a marine hand pump and the head was a porta-potty. People these days are used to so many creature comforts! ;-) The emphasis in the 50's trailers was on lightness and simplicity, which is an excellent thing in very small camp trailers.</p>
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<p>I also have a Progressive Dynamics smart charger and monitor, which is a huge improvement over the original Dumb Charger. 60's - 70's electronics leave much to be desired.</p> WOW, I see this topic is be…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-23:2093474:Comment:2904752016-04-23T15:12:45.322ZJohn "T" Nordhoffhttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/profile/JohnT
<p> WOW, I see this topic is being re visited. I posted long ago and maybe its time for an update and to answer the posters actual questions. He talks bout a 12 FOOT TRAILER NOTTTTTTTTTTT SOME HUGE ENERGY HOG DUAL AC MOTORHOME.</p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;">"We have a 12ft trailer............ I would like to add 2 6v batteries to the trailer to run the few lights, outlets and an electric burner for…</span></p>
<p> WOW, I see this topic is being re visited. I posted long ago and maybe its time for an update and to answer the posters actual questions. He talks bout a 12 FOOT TRAILER NOTTTTTTTTTTT SOME HUGE ENERGY HOG DUAL AC MOTORHOME.</p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;">"We have a 12ft trailer............ I would like to add 2 6v batteries to the trailer to run the few lights, outlets and an electric burner for cooking."</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> I WOULD FORGET ABOUT ELECTRIC COOKING using only 12 VDC!!!!!!!!!</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> ANSWER: For only a 12 foot trailer and you mentioned 2 6 volt batteries, that should suffice well. I recommend they be true deep cycle golf cart batteries connected, of course, in series which would provide around 220 Amp Hours of 12 VDC energy storage.</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> "So my question is, how do you wire the battery up to the breaker box and still leave a plug in for when there is shore power?"</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> Typically there would be a 12 VDC distribution panel with a few automotive blade type fuses in the 10 to 15 amp range for a few circuits to vent fans or 12 VDC lights or water pump etc etc. Often there is a COMBINATION 120 VAC (with circuit breakers) and 12 VDC (with blade auto fuses) often with a Converter/Charger built in which provides DC to charge the battery when plugged into shore power. The DC feed is wired from the DC distribution panel to the battery bank and the incoming AC feed serves the AC distribution panel to prove power cvia circuit breakers to AC and microwave and fridge and convenience receptacles and the 120 VAC to 13 + - VDC Converter/Charger</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> "What I do know is that we will need and inverter from the battery to make it A/C but the invertors that I see on-line all have a cigarette lighter hook up."</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> Those cigarette lighter fed inverters are for low power (say 200 to 300 watt range) electronics and chargers and computers etc. Id use at least a 400 watt PURE SINE WAVE (PSW) Inverter hard wired and fuse protected to the battery bank output. That will run a TV and computer and chargers etc etc small electronics but NOT any huge loads. </span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> "</span><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;">Is there one that can be connected to the battery cables?</span></p>
<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> YES see above hard wire a say 400 Watt PSW Inverter</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> "Then how do I wire the inverter to the breaker box? Or is there a special inverter for just this need?"</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> You could wire it to a 12 VDC fuse in your 12 VDC panel IFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF it can handle a big enough fuse orrrrrrrrr wire it direct to the battery bank output with its own fuse and NOT feed it via the 12 VDC panel, that's how I did mine.</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> IT ALL DEPENDS ON THE SIZE OF THE INVERTER YOU CHOOSE. a Cigarette lighter type is smaller maybe 200 to 300 watts max ( and often MSW not PSW) while a 400 watt (I prefer a PSW) is often wired to the batteries direct. </span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> "Lastly, how will the batteries re-charge, if I am hooked up to shore power will they re-charge?"</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> They recharge when on shore power via a cheaper often built into a 12 VDV 120 VAC Combination panel Converter/Charger which is fed by a 120 VAC panel circuit breaker. HOWEVER to increase battery life I prefer a SMART 3 or 4 stage charger then the cheaper more like a constant 13.4 to 13.6 voltage source DUMB single stage charger.</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> CLOSING</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> I dont see a 12 foot trailer needing a 50 amp service whatsoever. Ive owned and bought and sold RV's and used them over 40 years and if only one AC a 30 amp 120 VAC service suits me fine. My 29 Ft Class C has one AC, Microwave, LP/Electric Fridge. I have four deep cycle golf cart batteries 460 Amp Hours, 400 watts of rooftop solar panels, a 2000 watt and a 400 watt PSW Inverter and an Onan 4 KW Genset.</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;">CAUTION if you install a 120 VAC Panel DO NOTTTTTTTTTTTTT BOND THE NEUTRAL AND GROUND BUSSES The Neutral must be insulated and isolated off Ground Buss and case/frame.</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;">A combination Inverter/Charger while convenient is expensive and may be overkill for a 12 foot trailer. I chose a Progressive Dynamics 4 stage SMART charger and the PSW Inverters mentioned above. I removed the old hot noisy buzzing DUMB Converter/Charger</span></p>
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<p><span style="color: black; font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; font-size: 13pt;"> John T Retired AC Power Distribution Electrical Engineer</span></p> Agree mostly. A vintage campe…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-23:2093474:Comment:2901892016-04-23T14:21:55.626ZOld soldierhttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/profile/SamueljamessmithSR
Agree mostly. A vintage camper restored and ugraded for conveniences we consider "required" today, however, go against your statement. Modern campers come with either 30 amp for lower to moderate expense and size. Larger campers with modernized kitchens, entertainment centers, electric faux fireplaces, and such will come with 50 amp service. Yes, you can get along with a 30 amp service most of the time these days. But it is easy to forget the 30 amp power budget when going about daily…
Agree mostly. A vintage camper restored and ugraded for conveniences we consider "required" today, however, go against your statement. Modern campers come with either 30 amp for lower to moderate expense and size. Larger campers with modernized kitchens, entertainment centers, electric faux fireplaces, and such will come with 50 amp service. Yes, you can get along with a 30 amp service most of the time these days. But it is easy to forget the 30 amp power budget when going about daily functions. My wife causes either camper or campground utility post circuit breakers: infrequently, since she is very intelligent and an exoerienced camoer, but it happens. No one counts amps before flipping a switch. You don't have to...the disappearance of power is proof "you done messed up". And as for 6 and larger gauge wire not being immediately available....that is true only if you aren't near "big box" building supply stires (Lowes, HD, Ace, etc, etc). Where do you think home builders get their building supplies? At those and other building supply centers. Don't forget: there is nothing mystical and magical about camper building supplies. Six gauge wire fir a house is the same six gauge wire used in a camper. But yes, it is harder to find larger gauge stranded wire than solid copper conductors. The camper manufacturers of modern campers with 50 amp services have to follow NEC, ASWG, and RVIA standards in order to sell their products. As for ACs being 30 amp so that 12 gauge can't power them: you must be talking about some AC type not installed nofmally in a camper. My new AC for our Fireball is a Dometic made for campers....it calls for twelve gauge wire. Yes, it is fine to jump up to a larger than minimum gauge wire IAW NEC and ASWG! Maximum ampacity for #12 copp…tag:goodoldrvs.ning.com,2016-04-22:2093474:Comment:2901762016-04-22T17:49:05.118ZMatthew Tritthttps://goodoldrvs.ning.com/xn/detail/u_1xuchw22d2r3t
<p>Maximum ampacity for #12 copper is 20. If you have a 30 amp AC (as in alternating current) shore power connection, the conductors from main plug to breaker box must be at least #10. If you have a 50 amp plug, you must use #6! (The maximum ampacity of THHN conductors is actually dependent on maximum ambient temperatures so check your NEC before installing). # 6 is very large cross section and it's uncommon to find flexible SO cord of that size at the local hardware store. A 30 amp service…</p>
<p>Maximum ampacity for #12 copper is 20. If you have a 30 amp AC (as in alternating current) shore power connection, the conductors from main plug to breaker box must be at least #10. If you have a 50 amp plug, you must use #6! (The maximum ampacity of THHN conductors is actually dependent on maximum ambient temperatures so check your NEC before installing). # 6 is very large cross section and it's uncommon to find flexible SO cord of that size at the local hardware store. A 30 amp service should be more than adequate for most vintage RV applications, considering the number and type of circuits they were built with. Just use common sense when powering-up that air conditioner and electric hot plate at the same time and you'll be OK.</p>