Plumbing Question...

[Dawn Michelle]

Alrighty!  I'm finally off the roof (yay!) and starting to trace my systems and I have a plumbing question if anyone can throw their two cents in?  

My tank is under one of the dinette seats and I think I got that all figured out.  The pic is from above and shows tank on the left and wall of the camper on the right.  The big hose with the green stripes is the tank fill, the pex from the wall is the city water fill (and it curves down and out along with the top left pex from the tank) to the other dinette seat where the water pump is housed (pic #2).  Then the center white top hose out of the tank that goes straight down and out is the overflow and I assume the lower bottom hose that also goes down and out is a way to empty the tank without running it through the system.  Found both those connections bottom side of the RV.  This pic doesn't show it but the tank at one time had sensors - but someone clipped the wires down to the bolts (grumble).  Well, that's okay.  If I find I really need them, I'll make it project next year to pull it out and put new ones in.

But, to my question - next shots are an overview and then closeups of the water pump and the connections (left and right).  This is where I'm a little confused.  In my old Bounder I don't remember switching anything (and certainly not plumbing connections) in order to use water from the tank rather than the city water.  But looking at this - it appears the tank pex hooks into the water pump and then the water pump hooks into one line heading off towards the bathroom (and the lines appear to go under the shower pan (shower uses the sink faucet as its supply) and behind the toilet and then under the kitchen cabinet where the water heater lives.

And the city water connection comes out and has two end points, both capped (one loose - the gold one which is laying up against the pump - and which I assume is what I'd hook to the line that goes on into the bathroom if I want to use city water, completely bypassing the pump).

So my questions are - what is that tube coming off the valve going into the water pump?  And, shouldn't there be a way to plumb this so I don't have to manually keep switching connections each time I want to switch systems?  Also, if this is what it is, is there something like a quick disconnect like they have in propane?  I can't imagine constantly rehooking plumbing lines is a good idea....

And yes, I'm going to clean out in there - YUCK! - and ensure all the wires (the 12volt wiring runs through here - and the converter -is here which just seems a bad idea, too) are out of the way, and maybe even try to isolate the converter by rigging up some way to separate it from the possibility of a water leak in this area.

[Dawn Michelle]

I can visualize what you are saying and that makes sense.  I can now go back in and look at everything with an edu-ma-cated eye.  I'm going to dive into this over the weekend and I'll report back what I figure out!

[Dawn Michelle]

I took another look and yes, I think that there is some sort of manual diverter (has a lever) plumbed into the intake side of the water pump.  The gold fitting on the city water was just a cap.  So I'll find a better diverter and rework accordingly.

Now on how to separate the pump and most of the plumbing from the converter- it would make more sense for me to move the water pump out from under the dinette (since there's already all the wiring harness under there, grounds, etc.)  I'd still have the lines running through but could limit the connections and take extra care - maybe permanently seal them?

I'd already planned to turn the dinette into a U - putting my sealed AGMS for a solar system under the new seating area, but now I'm thinking I could replumb the pump there and put the batteries under the dinette - EXCEPT - can I put the batteries in the same compartment as the converter?  I know I've read I can't house the inverter in there but measurement wise I can fit two 100ah with three inches space between that and the converter - which also leaves me some room to create a divider.  The back of the converter isn't vented - just the sides and top and I could actually move the converter closer to the access door (which is screened - not a wood panel) to give me some more room.

Of course IF I can snuggle the battery and converter then I could even consider adding a third battery in one day.

I know I'm wandering out of plumbing into electric now but I have to think everything through before I start unbolting and moving stuff.

Another thought is to move the converter to the new seating bit (not my favorite idea but doable and house the batteries in a box under the dinette in a battery box with the pump).

Thanks again for everyone's opinions and thoughts on how they'd go about it!  I really don't have any other useable space nearby but I really think I can make this work if I think it through...

[Rich Thomas]

Hi Dawn, a couple things to mention: When you start to lay out your battery bay and converter locations, make sure you separate the batteries from the converter. Batteries on charge out gas and that gas is explosive, they should be kept away from any spark source and well ventilated: I have a similar layout on my water system as you do. My tank is located under a bench in my dining are and the pump is right there as well. Also in there is a fuse block for half of my  DC electrics. Dumb place to have that for sure. On a resent trip to Mid Ohio I had a hose brake on the tank and it drained the contents on the floor (Think 40 year old shag carpet) yea it was a mess. Any way I came to the conclusion that I'm going to fix that so it won't happen again. My thoughts are to move the fuse block, then pull everything out of the bay. Then install some type of water proofing. I thought I would find a plastic storage container that would be big enough to hold my fresh water tank, pump and fittings; put it in the bay with a nice sized drain hole to the ground and install a water sensor alarm on the floor of the container. I haven't done this yet but it is high on the to do list. Hope this is of some use to you and good luck on your continued rehab. Your doing a great job.

[Matthew Tritt]

I'm late to reply to this conversation, but I would like to mention a few things. First, not to worry about those sealed AGMs venting H gas under heavy charging. Being sealed prevents external venting. Batteries get quite warm while charging, and so will your converter. You should allow at least 3/4" between the converter ad the closest battery for cooling, whether there are vents on that surface or not. NEVER run water and electrics in the same space! The two are sworn enemies and the potential for bad juju is great. In my GTC, the converter, fuse panel and converter/charger control module are located under the fridge in a high and dry location. My original dinosaur converter produced a lot of heat, only charged at < 8 amps and was a real battery killer because of the single stage charging. I replaced it with a Charge Wizard, which is one of the best additions/mods I've done, along with the See Level II gauge system. The Wizard has by far the best charging algorithm. Can't enough good stuff about it.

 

[Rich Thomas]

I read that whole thread and it never soaked in AGM.!  I was scared to death she was going to blow her self up L.O.L.. I worked underground for 27 years in the mining ind. and safety has been drilled in to my DNA. The information I provided is valid for any one who has the non AGM. So hopefully it helped some one! 

[Dawn Michelle]

Hahah!!  No, I have to go with AGM - I don't see me cutting holes in the side of the camper to properly vent a regular set of lead acid.  BUT YES, it never hurts to remind.

It's funny some of the basic things I've missed along the way and have to facepalm myself when I realize it.  I still haven't figured out how I blew out the leads to my multimeter - everyone is sure I had the settings wrong.  I should have taken a picture after - now I doubt myself - heehee.

It's good to know about the batteries and converter will be okay in the same compartment as long as I give them some room to breath.  The water pump will the easiest thing to reposition.  

Alrighty - I have my next project scoped out - will report back with pics after I have it accomplished.  

[Dawn Michelle]

Thanks for feedback and the suggestions - I do have a charge wizard and new converter on my Amazon 'RV Solar' list!  

Not sure whether I'm going to replace the converter now, or wait til I get my solar and AGM bank. Planning that mod this fall.  Right now I just have a walmart special under the hood.  So thought I'd work with what I have until I had a better idea of what my electrical needs are going to be and wrap my head around some of the details of how my existing system works.  

Now, I may have misunderstood, but I thought I read that the biggest thing with the single stage was keeping an eye on the battery water levels because that heavy charging dried them out faster?  And it was that low water level that killed them? Did I get that wrong?

I did read somewhere that as a newbie I should be practicing and making all my mistakes on my first cheap battery :-)

[Lakota Wolf]

Hot Charging as us oldie timers call it, will BOIL the batteries,, hense, drying them out and rendering them junk in a short time. The Newer Inverter/converters are more advanced and set the charging rate in stages,, It SAVES batteries.

I fell prey to commercial brand sealed *marine type batteries that garanteed to never ever ever leak,,, well they leak,,, Imagine that... lol. My wish list is AGM 6 V battery bank, And since I have the available space,(or will make some), Im housing them in their own compartment, away from any heat or electrical source, and of course any plumbing.   An Ideal solution for me if I go off grid is to have an enclosed 12 ft by 6 ft trailer loaded with a huge battery bank and enough solar panels to light up a *small city like Dallas or Chicago, But thats just a thought. Its always good to look at the BIG picture of how you want things routed and stored...

[Dawn Michelle]

Hahah - yeah, can't go wrong with MORE POWER.  My wish list is for my Prius and Juno to have a baby, so I could then have a house I could drive around for $20 a month!  Now that would be nice.  

I watched some YouTubes with people that travel and camp in their Pri...what the heck is plural for Prius?  I couldn't see doing it myself but then I'd be in a lot less debt I suspect if I could've worked my way around to it!

[david craft]

There is a check valve built into the pump. No need to add another. In the original install, the union and brass cap were not installed and the resulting female was installed on the pump. The other capped line, with the aftermarket quest elbow, went to the cold manifold line, that the pump is connected to.

[Lakota Wolf]

David is correct on that,, On MOST pumps,, Ace Hardware's RV,utility pumps can run forward or backwards,(found that out testing one), The water would flow either way which I didnt think was a good design, allowing water to back feed. But after talking to RVworld guy.com/net/org/inc/com they sell original replacement RV water pumps WITH the check valve and they DON"T work both ways.... just my Dollar three ninety eights worth,

Thanks David for clarifying that for everyone, Very useful info.

[Dawn Michelle]

Well by the time I saw this I'd already purchased and installed - but good to know it might not be needed (it's a shurflo).  

Unfortunately I've been slow getting all the plumbing dealt with (seems life keeps getting in the way) but who knows, maybe by this weekend I will have it finished.  Have to be optimistic!